Krk island; May 2015

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Re: Krk island; May 2015

Postby Mario Schweiger » Fri May 22, 2015 10:05 am

Jeroen Speybroeck wrote:Also, between a true find and a lie, there's also the option of a mistake, no?

Not in this case, I think: date, exact location, picture,........

btw, this place has been visited by Czech and Bavarian colleagues two weeks before
Zwischenablage02.jpg

full report of our Bavarian friends (in German):
http://herpetofauna.at/forum/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=3914&p=19590#p19590
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Please visit also my personal Herp-site vipersgarden.at
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Re: Krk island; May 2015

Postby Berislav Horvatic » Sat May 23, 2015 6:13 pm

Mario Schweiger wrote:I'm sure, Natrix tessellata doesnt have a native distribution on the island. All spotted specimens
(beside this one there is only one documented finding [M. Franzen]) are likely transported to Krk
(conscious or by chance).
Therefore, the chance to find one of these occasional finds years later again is like zero.

Regarding the find(s) of M. Franzen at the pond Miholjice (between Malinska and Njivice, by the road), he's not the only
one who has found them there, at that time (quite long ago). Ivo Peranić told me about one of his acquaintencies who
also found them there, in the same pond, roughly at the same time. But that's a closed story, nothing more found there
ever since... much as we tried.
However, if those "old" finds are to be ascribed to an alleged reptile dealer getting rid of his "surplus" of "Balkan stuff"
on the island of Krk, who's releasing them now, decades later? Why should anyone?
Regarding the (car-)ferry line Crikvenica-Šilo, as a potential "suspect", take into account that it ceased its service at
least two decades ago... Only small taxi-boats remained, and I doubt a snake could use them to inconspicuously reach
the island...
You see, I dont like to write - it was a fake - here, although the specimen remembered me very well to those occuring
around lake Vrana in N-Dalmatia ;)

Anything else to add to this quite intrigueing "en passant" comment? I suppose "remembered" was meant to mean
"reminded" (forgive me the "nitpicking", everybody, PLEASE...), but we all got the gist of the message, so...?
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Re: Krk island; May 2015

Postby Thomas Bader » Sat May 23, 2015 8:33 pm

Anything else to add to this quite intrigueing "en passant" comment
- well Bero and Mario, only one thing (and I don't know if it has been already discussed, because II haven't followed the discussion:

When I first (herpetologically) visited the island of Cres in 2002, Fritz Tiedemann told us the story about N. tessellata (and also Bombina) reports by Bruno from lake Vrana on the island. We got a permit to visit the lake during bad weather and nothing was found which led us to the result that it was another story by Mr Bruno. The area is protected (water reservoir) and access ain't allowed (normally).
According to Gerald O. Croatian students found (I think) 3 individuals of tessellata there last year (I guess you know the story much better than me). That's all I wanted to add...
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Re: Krk island; May 2015

Postby Berislav Horvatic » Sat May 23, 2015 8:50 pm

Thomas Bader wrote:According to Gerald O. Croatian students found (I think) 3 individuals of tessellata there last year.
(I guess you know the story much better than me).

Well, actually I do. The "story" has already been published, by most reliable people (my word for that!), i'ts a true story,
and the PDF file of the article (from the "Hyla bulletin") is almost certainly in our (or Mario's) literature database. What
more would anyone want/request/hope for? In any case, here it is:
http://hrcak.srce.hr/index.php?show=cla ... zik=188283
The two authors are women (Homo sapiens sapiens females), but I do guarantee that they are both sapientes indeed...
Formally, they both have a (whatever it's now called - the second one, the real one...) diploma in biology and, informally,
I've been present at both of the defences of their theses, as I have known them for years, and have spent many a day in
the field with them, so, no doubts, no problem. The authors are most reliable, as well as the finds. Nothing to do with
Silvio Bruno and/or alike...
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Re: Krk island; May 2015

Postby Michael Wilms » Wed May 27, 2015 9:09 am

Finally I corrected my mistake in the Trip Report (also in the long versions on my homepage)!

Since Saturday I'm in Croatia again. The first two days on the Plitvice lakes were unfortunately very rainy. Now we (my girlfriend and me) are at the Novigradsko more since Monday.
Yesterday it was cloudy and windy and today the sun shines the first morning, but we have Bora.
So yesterday I only found Anguis fragilis and 7 Lacerta viridis (I was searching in the mountains above 1000 m a.s.l.).

I hope the weather gets better!

Oops, sorry! I wrote this in another thread than I wanted! :o
I thought I'm writing in my Croatia Trip Report 2013 Thread..
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Re: Krk island; May 2015

Postby Berislav Horvatic » Wed May 27, 2015 8:27 pm

Michael Wilms wrote:I was searching in the mountains above 1000 m a.s.l.

You can safely call it "Mt. X" - whoever knows the (hi)story, will understand what you mean, while the undeserving, "bad"
guys, hopefully, won't... (Unless they do a lot of searching of scientific literature, which they should (presumably) be just
too lazy to do. Again, hopefully...)
BTW, when you're there, the prominent sharp peak you see to the northwest is "Mt. Y" - for friends only, again... But no
road, it takes at least two hours on foot... So, maybe some other time.

I hope the weather gets better!

It will, as of tomorrow (Thursday). I would recommend Friday as "day D" for visiting "Mt. X" again, this time with a
bunch of ursiniis at your hands - found, caught, photographed, and (of course!) released where found... After all,
you're supposed to be one of the good guys, so you deserve it... Wish you luck.
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Re: Krk island; May 2015

Postby Berislav Horvatic » Thu May 28, 2015 12:04 am

Michael Wilms wrote:Oops, sorry! I wrote this in another thread than I wanted! :o
I thought I'm writing in my Croatia Trip Report 2013 Thread..

Just never mind... At this time of the day (or, rather, deep in the night), in vacations, under so much stress...
(clouds, rain, strong bora wind, maybe even a frustrated girlfriend... hopefully not!) just everyone will quite
certainly tolerate it...
All the best on "Mt. X" - tomorrow, or whatever that means at this time of night...
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Re: Krk island; May 2015

Postby Jeroen Speybroeck » Fri May 29, 2015 7:29 am

Berislav Horvatic wrote:The two authors are women (Homo sapiens sapiens females), but I do guarantee that they are both sapientes indeed...

What's with the "but"!? How is it at all relevant that they are women?
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Re: Krk island; May 2015

Postby Berislav Horvatic » Fri May 29, 2015 1:27 pm

Jeroen Speybroeck wrote:
Berislav Horvatic wrote:The two authors are women (Homo sapiens sapiens females), but I do guarantee that they are both sapientes indeed...

What's with the "but"!? How is it at all relevant that they are women?

Forget about the unfortunate "but", PLEASE... No "Freudian slip", just a stupid slip of mine. I do apologize, if need be,
to THEM, but I'm quite sure they would never take offence from me, they would just take it as a joke from a friend...
The facts: They are both young women, both are quite sapientes & able, and I like & respect them both very much.
And we've known each other for years. All clear, I hope. The "but" that troubled you was just a mild "insider" joke.
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